Episode Transcript
Speaker 1 00:00:04 Hello, everybody. Welcome to another episode of All Things Considered Franchising, powered by Scott Mylo franchise coach.com. I am your host, Scotty Mylo. All Things Considered Franchising is a podcast dedicated to the franchising industry, entrepreneurs seeking to get into the business for the first time, and people looking to diversify a portfolio, a range of subjects. Uh, Scott Mylo franchise coach.com is a consulting organization that I founded many years ago that, uh, helps people, uh, research and explore business ownership, building a business model, and then introducing the, uh, opportunities that fit. I have a very, very interesting guest today and somebody I've kind of, we've, we've just kind of watched each other for over gosh mm-hmm. <affirmative>, it's gotta be over 10 years now, and, uh, you know, just, and, and we thought it would be a great idea to, uh, actually, uh, be on each other's podcast. So, that's right. I, I guess I drew the short straw. And I'm first and, uh, I'd like to welcome, uh, Martin McDermott, uh, who is president and founder of Franchise Interviews, uh, for anybody who has been watching podcasts and, uh, looking for information on franchising, franchising interviews, is a leader in that category. Been around for almost 17 years, or, or 17 years now. And Martin is also a, uh, pro a, uh, professor over at Purdue University in their global division, uh, teaching, marketing, and, uh, uh, course leadership on marketing, I guess. Correct. Yeah, that's
Speaker 2 00:01:30 Right. Welcome
Speaker 1 00:01:31 To the show, Martin <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:01:32 Thank you, Scott. Like I said, it's a privilege to finally be able to speak to you face to face. As I mentioned earlier, I feel like I know you already, so I'm talking to an old friend, so, uh, this is, this is a privilege for me.
Speaker 1 00:01:44 You know, um, you and I, uh, since we've kind of circled the globe here in franchising, we won't go into, you know, ages or anything, but we've been around the block. You certainly have had your, uh, finger on the pulse of the franchising industry, but there have been a lot of changes over the years. Yes. Um, you know, it's become a political topic. Um, you know, what's going on in California and some of the other states mm-hmm. <affirmative>, but franchising still is a reliable, uh, and a, um, what's the word? Uh, I'm looking for just a reliable opportunity or option for people to explore in business ownership. Give us your take and what you're seeing in the franchising industry and just kind of your thoughts on if somebody out there is listening saying, Hey, I'm really thinking about it, but I don't know what to do at this point.
Speaker 2 00:02:33 Yeah, it's, you know what, it is interesting for me, Scotty, because when I got into franchising, when I started studying franchising back in, I was like 1999. I think at that time, there was only, I think about 1200 different systems from what I remember, the Iffa reports, I think today, I don't know how many were up to, it's like thousand. Is it 4,000?
Speaker 1 00:02:55 4,000? That's what the last Iffa meeting had, 4,000. That
Speaker 2 00:02:58 Number just keeps going up and up and up, doesn't it? You know? And I always say like, when is it going to stop at some point? You know, you see more industries franchising all the time, and, you know, I mean, I guess that could be a good thing. Right? And it could be a bad thing. Um, you know, what I love about franchising, Scotty, is someone said this on my show once, and I, and I, and I forget who it was, I'm gonna have to go back to give him credit, but he said that franchising is an unfair advantage in the sense that if you think about it with franchising, you're getting, and, and, and, and I'm preaching to the choir, but you're getting, you're getting two very important things. You're getting one, you're getting a sophisticated system that someone has worked on for a very long time, and you're also getting a strong brand in some cases, not all cases, but if you have those two things that take a very long time to build, you're, you're kind of starting, if you think about like the analogy of baseball, you're kind of starting on third base, right?
Speaker 2 00:03:50 Right. As opposed to starting on first base. So your chance of getting home is, is, is much quicker. You have a greater chance of doing that. And, you know, that's, that's what I love about franchising, um, is, is, is is the opportunity, you know, I actually study it to Scotty on a scholarly level. I think I mentioned to you, um, I have six publications on the topic interesting of, of franchising. Yeah. So I go a little bit deeper, you know, so when I'm doing a podcast, I'm kind of thinking, I'll say, okay, how can I apply this to research, you know, and, and, and, and get it published in a scholarly journal. Um, so, so, you know, that's one of the things that I, I do as well. And, um, it's amazing that I've been doing this show now for, for 16 years. I think I've done about 850 interviews. Wow.
Speaker 1 00:04:38 And
Speaker 2 00:04:39 Yeah. And, and one of the questions that I always ask at the end of the show, which I'm gonna ask yourself when I have you on it, it's always asked, what advice would you give to an aspiring entrepreneur looking to buy a franchise? And it's so interesting, Scotty, because, and I don't know if you can guess what the number one answer is, but it's over 50% of the time, my guest will say to me, do something that you're passionate about. Right. And I, I think that's important, right? I mean that, right? You wanna do something that you're passionate about and something you love, but there's gotta be a little bit more to it than that. Right?
Speaker 1 00:05:11 I I, I, you know what, uh, Martin, you are touching on a subject that, um, a, a topic that I, I 150% mm-hmm. <affirmative> agree with you mm-hmm. <affirmative>, it isn't always passion passions great. Don't get me wrong. Of course. Um, but, uh, you know, uh, in marriages there are a lot of passions, but there are a lot of bumps in the road too, <laugh>,
Speaker 2 00:05:30 Right? Right. Absolutely. And, you know, with, with our show too, Scotty, I always say that, you know, our show is more of an introductory point for aspiring franchisees. You know, we kind of introduce entrepreneurs to different particular brands, different topics, and then, you know, once someone comes to, to our webpage, if they find franchising to be a viable opportunity, then they go to guys like yourself. You know what I mean? Because Right. I think it's important that someone really does their homework. I think they need a lot of guidance from franchise consultants like yourself. In the old days, we used to call them brokers, right? Correct.
Speaker 1 00:06:08 Yep. Consultants is the new professional word. Right?
Speaker 2 00:06:11 Absolutely. And that, and you know, and that totally makes sense. I had, um, I appreciate your service so much, Scotty. One of the guests that I had on my show was such a long time ago, but there were these two gentlemen, they were looking to get into franchising. They used a franchise consulting service. I can't even remember which one it was. But when the franchise consultant came back to them, she recommended window cleaning as a viable opportunity for them. And both of them looked at her, they're like, are you crazy? To make a long story short, they ended up getting into, I think it was fish window cleaning, if I remember
Speaker 1 00:06:46 Correctly. Yep. Know the brand. Yep.
Speaker 2 00:06:48 They loved it. I mean, they were so happy they ended up buying another one, you know, and they became multi-unit franchisees. But I always say, wow. I mean, if it wasn't for a franchise consultant, maybe they would've steered towards some other opportunity that they said, okay, we're passionate about it. They weren't passionate about window cleaning. Right. But nevertheless, it turned out to be Right. An amazing opportunity for them. And, you know, franchising, it doesn't discriminate. I mean, it does, you know, you could have, Nope,
Speaker 1 00:07:17 It doesn't,
Speaker 2 00:07:18 A high school education, you could have a doctorate degree masters. It, it doesn't matter. I mean, it levels the playing field for everyone. And that's what I love about franchising, Scotty, is that if someone wants to be an entrepreneur, but maybe they don't know how to be an entrepreneur, franchising is, is a wonderful opportunity, isn't it? Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:07:37 It, it, it is. And, and, you know, you touch on, and, and just two comments about what you said that you know about the, uh, the two gentlemen you used about, uh, the window cleaning mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, I think sometimes, and, and this is one of the practices and conversations that I have with my clients, um, is that sometimes ego gets in the way of a decision process. Sure. You know, window cleaning or portable toilets or, you know, it's kind of like, you know, they're not comfortable gonna be sitting around the dinner table talking to friends and say that they owned a window cleaning business. Right. Yet they don't see the upside to where their goals are. Right. Uh, you know, that it gets them to their goals or could potentially get them to their goals. Right. Um, so it, it, it's just interesting that how ego and the other thing is, is that it's research, uh, you know, uh, look, you've been around the block and everybody, it, it seems to be the, uh, the white flag that gets thrown up. I wanna do some research mm-hmm. <affirmative>, and, you know, there's no better research than talking to the brand and then talking to the franchisees within the brand. Everybody says, I want to go online, I want to do some research. I wanna look at Google reviews. Right. Or Yelp reviews. And I'm like, I'm saying, well, wait a minute, how often do you see a Yelp review that's positive <laugh>?
Speaker 2 00:08:50 So,
Speaker 1 00:08:51 I mean, so, you know, so if you don't have thick skin to handle reviews, then maybe you shouldn't be a business owner. So, um, you know, in any type of format, you know, an independent or a franchisee. So, uh, right.
Speaker 2 00:09:02 Right.
Speaker 1 00:09:02 Well, let me ask you this, Martin, you know, you, you've, you've, you, you've seen a lot of people, um, you know, come across your airwaves, a lot of people mm-hmm. <affirmative>, you've met a lot of people that, uh, have been successful. You probably know some people that struggled.
Speaker 2 00:09:16 Yes. Um,
Speaker 1 00:09:17 What do you see maybe one or two commonalities between the people that are successful mm-hmm. <affirmative> in business ownership, franchising, and maybe a com a couple of common threads of people who you say struggle with it a little bit. Right. Any, I mean, any advice to our listeners on that?
Speaker 2 00:09:36 Yeah. I'm sorry. I'm losing my voice. It's, that's a great question, Scotty. Um, and it sounds kind of cliche, the answer that I'm going to give you, but I mean, there's, there's so much truth behind this is I think I know if you are going to get into buying a franchise, if you're a franchisee, I think you have to trust that system 100%. I had a woman on my show long time ago, um, her name is, uh, Julie Bennett. She wrote a book for Franchise Times. Okay. You, it's funny how Julie
Speaker 1 00:10:12 Yep. Yep. Oh,
Speaker 2 00:10:13 Julie, she wrote something in her book. I mean, it just stood out because I said, oh my God. I said, that's, this is franchising. She said she was interviewing a franchisee, and I couldn't remember wh which, which brand it is, because it's been so long since I've read the book. But the franchisee said this. She said, if the operations manual told me to write in Red Ink on Tuesday and Blue Ink on Thursday, I would do it.
Speaker 1 00:10:39 Right.
Speaker 2 00:10:40 You have to go into it having that trust, don't you? I, um, I interviewed one of the most successful franchisees to a brand, um, Liberty Tax, which you're probably familiar with. Yeah. And I, so my question was, what I wanted to know the most, Scotty, was when, when I had this gentleman on the show, as I said, how did you become the number one franchisee? You'll appreciate what he said. He, he said, all I did was what they told me to do. Yep. That was it. <laugh>, that was his, his response. You know, it wasn't like anything like, you know, oh, I'm this brilliant person. Um, I have all these different traits and things like that. I just did what they told me to do, what I had Tariq, um, for
Speaker 1 00:11:24 Edible arrangements. Yep. The edible
Speaker 2 00:11:26 Arrangements. Arrangements. He said the same thing to, he said, one of his most successful franchisees, he said, do whatever this guy referring to Tariq says, and you'll be successful. Right. And that's the truth, isn't it? I mean, so it is, if you are gonna go into it, you have to follow the system. There's no, and I hate, I hate when I say this, sometimes I think entrepreneurs get upset, but there's no creativity in franchising sometimes.
Speaker 1 00:11:50 You know what? You just hit the nail on the head because, uh, as we were talking before we started, uh, the air of the show, um, I, I had mentioned to you that I was down at a trade show down the, uh, duas Virginia era Chantilly, uh, through Franchise Expo, Michael Hyman and his group Dennis and I was speaking, uh, and one of the questions that came up was, why do people fail at franchising? And, and, and, and I said, you know, there's really two reasons that people fail. Uh, one is they go into this under capitalized.
Speaker 2 00:12:19 Correct.
Speaker 1 00:12:20 I said, there's really three reasons. The second is they really didn't have their partner or spouse support, so Correct. That kind of, and then the third one is they just didn't follow process. They're trying to reinvent the wheel. So I always try to explain to my clients that if you are a process entrepreneur, someone who can follow a process mm-hmm. <affirmative> to the T Right. Not, not saying that suggestions or ideas are unwanted. They are wanted, but they have to be uniformed to the brand. But if you can follow 99.99% or a hundred percent of the process, you are going to be successful if you are a, what I call an engineer type process. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, somebody who likes to put together all of the manuals and the marketing plans and want to be involved in every aspect of the business than being independent, don't go into franchising.
Speaker 2 00:13:11 And that's not easy. You're, you actually right, too. No, it's not, it's not easy to do, Scotty. Is it? I mean, I think about, you know, a lot of times people have said to me over the last 16 years, they're like, you know, you have this podcast, I'm franchising. Why don't you go into franchising? I don't know how good of a franchisee I'd actually be. You know what I mean? Because as, even though I have this, this tremendous appreciation for franchising, that's not easy to do, to find someone who will totally. Right. 100% trust the system. Um, that's very difficult. You know, franchising is, I, and I, I think John Hayes said this once, as he said, franchising isn't for everyone. It's not for most people. And I didn't understand the first time he said that when I was at one of these franchise shows. I was like, what is he talking about? You know, it's not for most people now. I get it. <laugh> 16 years later, <laugh>. You know. Um, so I think it does, it takes, it takes a special type of person to, to, to get into franchising. Um,
Speaker 1 00:14:04 Well, I think there's a human psychology to this as well, you know, as mm-hmm. <affirmative>, a a as people, as humans, our psychology is to kind of push back or, you know, wanna do something different or think we can do better. Right. So it's really hard sometimes as a a, as a business person, especially in franchising, just to sit back and say, okay, I'm gonna do this, and kind of rely on somebody else. Especially if you're the type of person that, you know, likes to tweak or, you know, just kind of take a chance or to speak <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:14:32 Right. Right. And that's me to some extent, just a little, I have a little bit of that in me, you know, Scotty. So that's why, you know, I would be a little hesitant for, to go into franchising, but nevertheless have this, this, this great appreciation for it as well. I, one of my favorite books, I don't know if you ever read it, is The EMyth Revisited Yeah. By Michael Gerber. And, um, I can't tell you how many times that book has been referenced on my show, whether it's from franchisees or franchisors, and I actually had the chance to interview Michael three times on my podcast. And, um, that's one book that I certainly recommend reading before you get into franchising. There's a lot of other good ones too out there, by the way, as well.
Speaker 1 00:15:15 Yep. There are.
Speaker 2 00:15:16 But that's one I would certainly take a look at. Yeah. You mentioned family support to Scotty. I mean, that's Yep. I'm glad you mentioned that, because this is very difficult, isn't it? You know, you even better than I do. Um, that, you know, you need that support, right? From your, your, your wife, your husband, your, your children. I mean, this is, this is a big commitment and, and you use the word marriage and, and a lot of times I compare it to a marriage, it's, it's at least a 10 year commitment in, in many instances. So, right. You're gonna have to have that support from, from your, your family, um, and you want to meet their family as well. I think I've heard this on your show. I can, I can give you credit, is you, you want to date a little, right? Yeah. You want to meet the family, meet the parents, right. And, and, and see what is the culture like and that family, it's interesting how life can be applied to, to franchise and couldn't it.
Speaker 1 00:16:09 Yeah. You know, I, Hey, look, I, I always, uh, I've shared a story about many years ago when, when I was part of, uh, the burger concept and Yeah. You know, uh, we had a husband and wife team come into Discovery Day and, uh, you know, he was this big, gentle, you know, bear, really friendly kind of guy, and she sat there with her arms crossed, you know, you know, didn't crack a smile and, you know, got up in the mi you know, 15, 20 minutes into a discovery day and insisted that somebody go to Dunking Donuts for her. And, you know, so, you know, my point is, is that we had to call up and say, okay, Bob, congratulations, we've been, we're gonna award you a franchise, but we have bad news. Well, what's the bad news, Scott? Well, we can't award a franchise to your, to your wife, so we're gonna have to pass on this, because, you know, it, it is. And then the other thing is, I've always used the analogy, you know, if your spouse went out or partner went out and spent 150, $200,000 without telling you or what it was about, you know, would you be aggravated or reached into your savings account? Or of course, retirement funds, so, right. You're absolutely right. The, the, the partnership, the spouse, you don't always have to agree with the franchise or, but you gotta get along
Speaker 2 00:17:20 <laugh>. Absolutely. 100%. Yeah. I think, I think that that's a great example. I love that example, by
Speaker 1 00:17:25 The way. Yeah. So, uh, but you know, anything else about the industry to our audience out there? I mean, about franchising? I mean, you, you, you, you've used it, you used the, uh, the, the, the terminology of like starting on third base. I love it. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, uh, I may have to steal that from you and start using it, but that, that, that's okay.
Speaker 2 00:17:41 I stole, I stole it from somebody. You, you know where I got that analogy from Scotty, um, a gentleman named George Na, he, um, I think he's the founder of Boston Chicken or Boston Market. He was a big bass Boston Red Sox fan. Um, and, um, he used that en analogy, so I have to give him credit. I stole that one. Yeah. <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:17:58 Right, right.
Speaker 2 00:17:59 So he gets credit for it. Yeah. But, um, that is a great analogy, but I mean, in, in, in, in thinking of other things too, Scotty, you know, is the whole process of due diligence, I, I think we kinda Yeah. Touched upon that. I mean, is I've of, I've often wondered, and I don't know this, you know, it better than I do, is how often does, how long does it take to actually buy a franchise from the time you, you, you say, okay, I wanna start looking up franchise opportunities to the time you make the decision. It's gotta be a long process. I know. 90
Speaker 1 00:18:31 To 120 days, if not longer.
Speaker 2 00:18:33 Yeah. If not longer. You know, because if you are going to truly speak to franchisees that are currently in the system for the brand that you're interested in, that can take a long time too. You know, in setting up appointments, talking to them on the phone, and things of that nature. Um, so I I I, I, I imagined it's a very long process.
Speaker 1 00:18:54 Yeah. It's a Yep. It is. It, it, it's 90 to 120 days, if not longer. And, and to be honest with you, anybody who's really in a hurry, that's when I get a little concerned. I mean, you know, it's, uh, it's, it's, those are the people that I have a concern, Hey, I'm in a hurry. I gotta get this, I gotta start a business, you know, I lost my job. I gotta get, it's like, whoa, slow down <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:19:14 Right. Of course. Of course. I like the franchise shows too, though. I, like, I haven't been to a franchise show, Scotty, um, since Covid. So it's, it's been about three years since I've been to one, but I miss going to those, you know, I used to go to the one at the Jacob Javitz.
Speaker 1 00:19:27 Yes. The big one on by mfe GaN everybody. Yep. I
Speaker 2 00:19:31 Used to love to go to the shows, just, just walk around and see all the new concepts and opportunities and get to speak to people, you know, that were on my podcast and the past, you know, cuz you feel like you know them once you interview them. And, um, I, I really have to start getting back out there and, and doing that again. You know? Cuz cuz those are a lot of fun, aren't they?
Speaker 1 00:19:50 They are. I mean, this one I did this past weekend was, I mean, I think they had close to 3000 registrations really. I mean, it was just, it was nonstop, uh, from, um, morning until close. I mean, it was, uh, birthday Saturday and Sunday, so, uh Right, right. And it was really nice. But these, these, these shows have a lot of what we call the embryonic brands. Mm-hmm. The ones that just started franchising and starting, you know, a few name pick brands there. But, uh mm-hmm. <affirmative>, it, it's great to talk to people and it's, I I always find it interesting that when people come up to me, they go, can you help me find the perfect franchise? And I'm like,
Speaker 2 00:20:21 <laugh>,
Speaker 1 00:20:22 Perfect. Well, what's perfect? You know? Uh,
Speaker 2 00:20:25 There's no such thing. Right, Scotty? I mean,
Speaker 1 00:20:28 No such thing is it? Nope. Nope. There's
Speaker 2 00:20:30 No such thing. E even when, you know, I, I had another gentleman on my show, uh, we were talking, I think, I think he might have been in real estate at one point of his life and, and people would, uh, say, you know, I want the perfect home. And there's no such thing as a perfect home when you're buying real estate too. Right. Right. I mean, there's always, you're always gonna find something wrong with that house, you know, whether it's the windows or the basement or something like that. I, I think franchising is very similar to that process. It'll never be 100% perfect. You'll never find that 100%
Speaker 1 00:20:56 Opportunity. I think the best guidance I give people, or at least try to give people is look, you know, after 90, 120 days and it's time to make a decision mm-hmm. <affirmative>, um, if you're not excited about your potential Right. And that you feel that you could be a great business owner Right. And maybe be the number one franchisee in the system. Right. You probably shouldn't do it because the, I think that's really what it boils down to. I mean, there's always gonna be fear and anxiety. Sure. Uh, you know, you don't want fear and anxiety to be your decision driver, but fear and anxiety also drives more questions. But, uh, if you're mm-hmm. <affirmative>, you know, going into it to make the decision, it's okay to be nervous and scared, but of course you just have to have the 150% confident, you know, it's like people that wanna open a burger or a pizza concept today. Sure. They go, you know, the, the pushback is, is that, oh, there's just so many per pizza and burger places and chicken and sucks. Right, right. And my comment has always been, yes, but it pleases the masses. There's a lot of opportunity. Right. And you just gotta be better than everybody else.
Speaker 2 00:21:58 Exactly. <laugh> you, you, you have to set your goals high too. Yes. Don't you, Scotty? You know. Yep. It's, um, when, when I was speaking to, um, Michael Gerber, he, he, he said something fantastic. He said, most businesses fail not because they think too big, but because they think too small. And I thought about that for a while. I said, that's very interesting, you know, is, is maybe we should think beyond the one one unit franchise, you know what I mean? And say, yeah. Right. I want to be the number one franchisee to a system. That's a big goal, isn't it? Or, you know, I wanna own two of these or three of these, or maybe 10 of them one day. You know? And I think sometimes that, that gets you excited, you know, when you set those goals really high. Cuz sometimes if you fall a little short, that's not so bad, is it? You know, but when you set your goals really low
Speaker 1 00:22:43 Right.
Speaker 2 00:22:44 You know, maybe go a little bit higher, you know, so Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:22:47 You know, it's, it's the person that says, Hey, I got a hundred thousand dollars. I wanna invest it in a business, but I wanna make a half a million dollars a year. Correct. Well, yeah. Great. Show me where you can find it and I'll give you the hundred thousand dollars. Me
Speaker 2 00:22:57 Too. <laugh>. Likewise.
Speaker 1 00:23:00 It's, uh, well, we've been talking to, uh, Martin McDermott, who is, uh, president, founder of Franchise Interviews, also a, uh, professor of marketing over at, uh, Purdue University. Um, I'm, this is Scotty. My, I'm the host of All Things Considered podcast, all Things Considered Franchising. Martin, any last words? Any encouraging words for, uh, our, our, our, our entrepreneurs? Whether you're looking to diversify a portfolio, uh, add on or do this for the first time. Any other last encouraging words you wanna pass on and where people can get ahold of you or, uh, listen to some of your interviews and, uh, podcast themselves?
Speaker 2 00:23:36 No, absolutely. Scotty, I really appreciate this opportunity to, to, to get to speak with you today. And as I mentioned, I'm gonna have you, uh, on my podcast, so I'm looking forward to that as well. So, um, so for your listeners, they can go to franchise interviews.com and again, they can hear every single interview that I've done from day one, Scotty, to the very first interview we did was back in 2006 with a franchise called PB Loco. It was a peanut butter franchise. Interesting. They're not in existence anymore. Yeah. <laugh> <laugh>. But, and, and that's the interesting thing too, Scotty, you know, is, is, you know, a lot of the franchisors, you know, over the last 16 years that have been in my show, uh, on my podcast, they don't even exist anymore. Some of them, you know, yeah. Most of them are still out there, you know, but, but there are situations where a franchise just does not make it, you know, so it's not, it's not a 100% guarantee.
Speaker 2 00:24:26 It's not a home run every single time. Just as you mentioned, there's so many variables to get into. Yep. Um, or, or, or, or take into consideration why something works or why something you know, doesn't work. But again, overall, I, I think I've been doing the podcast such a long time because I truly believe in, in the franchise model, you know, the ability to get into a business that has a strong kickass system, uh, a great brand. Um, those are very important things, you know, going back to that analogy of starting on third base, you know, as you can get to home a lot quicker. Um, so again, uh, franchise interviews.com, you can hear every single interview that I've ever done. That's great. To this point, and, and this has been a privilege for me to get to, to speak to you.
Speaker 1 00:25:09 Great. Well, this is Scotty, my, uh, your host today for all Things Considered Franchising. To listen to more of my podcast, you can go to YouTube, Spotify, uh, uh, apple, or go to All Things Considered dot, uh, all things considered franchising.com, a brand new, spanking new website with a list of all of our podcasts. Or you can head to Scott Milo franchise coach.com. If you're, uh, thinking about, uh, or like to start the journey of researching and exploring business ownership, as I tell people who start the journey that at the end of the journey no is okay. You aren't required to say yes. Uh, I think it's sometimes it takes a lot more courage to say no than yes, but, uh, it, it, it is an option to say no. So, uh, uh, Martin, again, great to have you. Uh, I hope we get you back in the next Scotty six months or so, just to see where the industry is and yeah. I'm sure we'll be bumping into each other and, uh, <laugh>, uh, enjoy the time with your son eating those hamburgers, cuz I know that's, I will
Speaker 2 00:26:05 <laugh>. Thank you Scotty. This has been a privilege. Thank you. This
Speaker 1 00:26:09 Is Scotty Myers saying So long Fornell.
